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K. McAleese said on June 25th, 2008 at 11:04 am

*Applause*

You’ve got to wonder what they’re smoking when they compare Katrina and the current floods.

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I can’t tell you how happy I am that I have somehow avoided seeing any such comparisons. I simply don’t have the energy today to go quite that postal.

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[…] Deflating the self reliance triumphalism. […]

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Great post, MGK.

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Cheers on this post. well said. I’d been avoiding the right wing posts you destroy here just because it’s all so damn discouraging. but yes, you win

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At various times of my life, I’ve lived in the Midwest (Tornado Alley zone more than flood zone) and the coast … and I’d rather deal with floods than hurricanes. Any day of the week. But they’re both disasters when they happen, and it’s disgusting when people start judging which kind of victims are more “worthy” of help.

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THANK YOU.

This goes to every wingnut relative I have.

A.

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Thanks for writing this. I’ve done my best to ignore the use of the Iowa flooding to bash Louisianans. But I’m glad someone is calling their bluff.

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reynardine said on June 25th, 2008 at 12:47 pm

Okay, Chris. You know I live in Iowa, so let me correct you on a few points that may not have made the national news.

Evacuations: there were some mandatory evacuations and they were followed because the police went door to door and made sure they were followed. Most people in Iowa have cars because the public transport here stinks.

Flood vs. Hurricane: The rivers rose VERY FAST and much higher than anyone expected. There were people who had to be rescued in Cedar Rapids because they weren’t ordered to evacuate because the river had never gone that high and people had no idea. The same thing happened in Decorah and Anamosa. The slow-rising river theory only worked for cities in the southern part of the state, like Des Moines and Iowa City.

Access: two major highways (80 and 380) were flooded out, as well as many of the smaller roads. In fact, it was very difficult to travel anywhere in Eastern Iowa for about two weeks. Traffic was being routed hundreds of miles out of the way to keep people off of the flooded highways until they were repaired.

Size matters: There were more people affected by Katrina because a lot more people live down there on the Gulf Coast. The whole state of Iowa has maybe 3 million people tops. However, we have more farmland and lost more crops, plus the Mississippi is still shut down to barge traffic. And there are small towns that were destroyed in the flood that may never rebuild, places like Gays Mills (just over the river in Wisconsin) or Columbus Junction. Poor New Hampton got hit by a tornado just a few weeks ago, and THEN flooded out. Most of the media coverage focused on the bigger cities, but besides Cedar Rapids, most of the worst damage was in the smaller towns, who can least afford to rebuild.

Looting: there have been a couple of cases of looting reported in Cedar Rapids. Not of food, but of goods.

Accepting government aid: Of course people are applying for government aid! Iowans are poor, not stupid.

I’m not dissing Katrina and the damage it caused. I’ve got family down in Mississippi and Louisiana, family who lost their homes and still haven’t rebuilt because of the red tape. But give Iowa its due: the local and state governments did a fantastic job of coordinating things and working to keep people safe. And the community spirit here is very strong.

Also, I have to say this. In 1993, there was major flooding here, and the communities took note and DID SOMETHING ABOUT THE PROBLEMS. The 2008 floods dwarfed the 1993 floods, but because of all the extra infrastructure, some of the disasters from 1993 were averted (like, say, the water crisis in Des Moines). There were problems with the levees in New Orleans for years, but due to neglect, they were not fixed. The flooding issues here in Iowa in 1929 and 1965 and 1993 WERE addressed and that saved a lot of sorrow for this time around.

I’m not sure why the right-wing pundits are crowing about Iowa. We have a Democrat governor and a Democrat majority in our state congress, plus the majority of our national congressmen are Democrats.

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As a native Iowan (from one of the severely affected cities) who has spent the last 20 years living along the Gulf Coast, I can say that this post should be required reading for the nation at large!

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Reynardine, American conservative views are based entirely on self-inflicted lies. Any tall tale or half-truth that allows them to think they have a clue about how to run a society will be taken as fact until they are proven wrong over and over again.

At which time, they merely switch to a different lie.

Actually, I was able to get out of Cedar Rapids (heading northeast from the southwest side) with little effort, once I had the proper information, that is. Linn County really needed better information on their website for those of us that don’t have television. A shitty pdf of downtown road closures did not cut the mustard and cost me over two hours getting out of town a couple weeks ago.

But once I got north of 151 (30) on 380, all I had to do was take 100 (Collins Rd) to 151 business and it was a straight shot to Dubuque – with surprisingly little traffic. Then in two days, I got back with a shitload of goods at Madison prices.

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Honestly, any time I hear “I’m not a racist, but…” I already know – you are. You’re about to sugar coat things and dress it up, but a pig in a wedding gown is still a pig. Anyone trying to profit politically or socially off a tragedy like this deserves a curb-stomping.

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What a relief(sorry for the pun).

As a Katrina refugee, I am very pleased that you put this together. It’s really a shame that in a country that claims patriotism as hallmark is so willing to blast one particular group over another, in particular with respect to something as tragic as a hurricane or a flood for that matter. The devastation in New Orleans was something that very few will ever understand, because instead of being there and getting the news that we received and seeing what we saw as it happened, they listened to BS from the media. There were extreme incidents in the wake of Katrina, but the one thing that was glaring in my eyes throughout the crisis was how much respect was mutually granted by the victims. There we were without food and water for days and it wasn’t rioting and gunfire, it was people doing the best they could to make the situation livable. Hope was the cry of everyone around me, Black, White, Hispanic, etc. Fear was present, but malicious intent was the furthest from our minds.

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I’m not sure why the right-wing pundits are crowing about Iowa.

Because they are trying to advance a racist ideology.

This is their math: Iowa = white folk; New Orleans = darkies; whites > !whites

HTH, HAND.

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Well I think that the real racism is the way you all go POINTING OUT all this racism, which is the real reason there’s so much racism!

/troll

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*applause*

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Well said. I’ll be referring people to this post to save breath.

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Andrew W. said on June 25th, 2008 at 5:28 pm

I think it’s actually pretty sad that for every MGK out to fight with facts and reason, there’s a dozen john’s just advocating curb-stompings. I thought coercing silence through threats of force was what the bad guys did.

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As a Hurricane Katrina victim, I would like to thank you for your well-researched and thought-out rebuttal. No one will ever really understand what happened in Katrina’s wake who wasn’t personally affected by it. I was DAMNED lucky to get out the day before the storm hit; and I spent a good month and a half glued to CNN crying and watching the devastation, seeing all those familiar streets underwater or empty, and I haven’t been able to get back home until just recently (I’ll be back in September).

What hurts is that a lot of people up here in the Midwest were all “Well, you shouldn’t live in an area so prone to hurricanes and flooding and it should all just be bulldozed and built elsewhere.” Now that Iowa and Illinois have dealt with the heartbreak of seeing their towns underwater, they’re so damned smug about “knowing to evacuate” and showing “pride enough in the community to rebuild.”

I am a born and raised Illinoisian, but my heart belongs to New Orleans, and it’s tearing me up that anyone on either side would be jerks and hypocrites about the other’s disaster. Yes, New Orleans was far worse – and we still feel screwed and neglected and bitter sometimes about the disparity in government response – but no one should be playing the “we dealt with it better” or “it wasn’t as bad as ours” cards. BOTH disasters were horrible and it just saddens and angers me that people are using them to play politics or be smug.

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[…] nice when someone says everything I wanted to say and I don’t have to get my fingers all tired from typing. Of course, he left out the part […]

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shipwack said on June 25th, 2008 at 7:27 pm

K. McAleese Says:
June 25th, 2008 la 11:04 am

“*Applause* You’ve got to wonder what they’re smoking when they compare Katrina and the current floods.”

Probably the same thing they were smoking when they were crowing about how all those hardy midwesteners survived a blizzard (an effin’ BLIZZARD!) without whining for government help, unlike those lazy shiftless New Orleans folk…

::sigh::

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What hurts is that a lot of people up here in the Midwest were all “Well, you shouldn’t live in an area so prone to hurricanes and flooding and it should all just be bulldozed and built elsewhere.”

As a Des Moines resident, let me tell you there were a number of people locally – not an overwhelming number, but not just a couple – who were still saying things to the effect of “Why would anyone build in a 100/500-year flood plain?” as they sat cozy in their houses and apartments on top of hills. People just like to feel smug.

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From Gentilly in the heart of New Orleans, I can only say “Thank you for this spirited and accurate defense of the truth”.

Make it around my parts and the drink’s on me Darlin’.

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Thank you for this.

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We are born and raised New Orleans and survived Katrina with mere scratches, but have the Mississippi River just up the road from us. As we watched all this unfold on TV, my husband scarcastically asked, “Why would anyone live where it could flood like that?” This disaster proves that no one is safe from natural disaster and we should pull together as a nation and not point fingers or blame. Every city and state is different. I was so angry when the CA fires, last year, were going strong and a certain person on the radio made reference of how everyone there was so calm and respectful compared to New Orleans. Well, I am sure if there were free massages, food, water, diapers, etc in the Dome, we could have been just as calm and respectful.

I, also, have to wonder if the Army Corp of Engineers will come under fire like they did down here. As for those saying our levees were neglected, well you can thank the federal government for that. It seems we must fight for every dollar we get for our wetlands and barrier islands, which help diminish hurricanes. Maybe if the federal government saw the importance in giving us 100 year flood protection then it would have saved a whole lot of money in the long run. Where is Al Gore when you need him?

Also, you think your gas prices are high just think if you lose the New Orleans port. How high would items that you take for grant will go? The whole reason for the Louisiana Purchase was for the port, show a little love for a city that is unique and gives so much. At least, our mother country gaves us a little support. 😛

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Thanks,
Good to hear from someone outside the New Orleans area.

Here’s a fun fact you missed. 80% of the population fled in advance of the Katrina. This aspect of the evacuation was for more successful than anyone realized. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_preparedness_for_New_Orleans and http://www.planning.org/katrina/reader/plannningmay2006.htm are useful reading.

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We have a Democrat governor and a Democrat majority in our state congress

No, Reynardine, you have a Democratic governor and a Democratic majority in your state congress. I’m not suggesting any intent on your part, but it would be nice if we could leave the childish GOP shibboleths out of the discussion.

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i just want to know if blackwater was deployed to iowa like it was in new orleans with orders to” shoot to kill”?

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Bless you. Good, good commentary and comparison.

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“Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn’t go away.” – Philip K. Dick

Thanks for the dose of reality. If your ever in the Crescent City, I’d like to buy you a drink.

…and it is Orleanian

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that article by the two emt’s you link to in the post – where they describe local police forcing people back into affected areas and actually confiscating their supplies – that’s one hell of a read.

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I have no idea what this post says, linked here from Dangerblond. Little white text agains a blue background equals about worst combination in history for readability.

Comments look okay though.

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You make some good points, but your argument has a few mistakes. For one thing, a hurricane is predictable. You claim that only the “storm paranoid” would bother to evacuate with the advanced warning, but the same is true for the floods. These floods, like Hurricane Katrina, outdid all predictions. I live in Des Moines, which didn’t get the severe flooding Cedar Rapids did, but I noticed a reapeating pattern as the floods got worse and worse: every day it seemed we heard on the news that the flood waters had passed some new benchmark that we had been assured they could not possibly pass two days earlier. First we heard that they would never make it over the emergency spillway from the large reservoir upstream of the city. Then we heard that they would never pass the records of 1993. Then we heard that they would never top or break the levees. Then we were told it was possible, but not plausible, and the day after that the city center was under a voluntary evacuation as it became more and more possible. At the end of it all, one levee in the city broke and the water was within a foot of the top of the rest.

In short, the floods did not have the advanced warning you suggest they had, and with repeated assurances that everything would be OK, it was not outside the realm of common sense to stay where one was and try to just live through it.

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