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mygif

I would seriously like to know how you fuck up Green Lantern, Daredevil, or Ghost Rider. For reals. It’s not like any of these people had to make a Martian Manhunter or Ant-Man movie, something that would have been legitimately difficult to pull off.

GL deserves every bit of savaging it’s getting precisely BECAUSE it is mediocre. It’s like blowing the extra point kick.

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mygif

I liked it. Okay, it does leave stuff to be desired, especially because Marvel movies get shit done. Aside from the Batman flicks, has there been any DC-based movies that hadn’t been misfires? Maybe it’s because Green Lantern was my first real hero (it was Kyle), but I was forgiving, even with the world according to Geoff Johns. And I want to get a sketch of the movie’s Parallax, because a giant CGI cloud with the Guardian body kinda rocks to me. I already got a head-start with Tomar-Re.

I’m guessing there won’t be a follow-up movie, where Sinestro goes towards the dark side, Hal learns that Sector 2814 consists of more than Earth, and Kilowog gets more than five minutes of screentime. I still think live-action Green Lantern can still work. My idea would be a new version of The Greatest American Hero, with Kyle Rayner as a freelance artist who gets handed a power ring by an alien with no real explanation. The ones that find out the secret is Alex (Kyle’s long-suffering girlfriend and budding reporter) and Alan Scott (publisher of the Los Angeles Sentinel with a secret of his own). In the end, you have to admit . . . it could have been a helluva lot worse.

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mygif

So basically, not only did the filmmakers not get the right idea about the yellow rings, but made it a point to spoon feed the wrong idea about the yellow rings to the audience.

Makes you wonder if they fuck-up on purpose in order to cash in on reboot money.

Murc, one apparently fucks up a Ghost Rider movie by having bad-ass but entirely pointless build-up scenes, using bad cliches to manifest villains, and then targeting kindergartners with the non-action scenes.

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Murc: Like hell a Martian Manhunter movie would be hard to pull off.

J’onn gets sucked from Mars by Erdel’s Machine. Scientist helps him acclimate by letting him watch old detective movies/TV shows and gorge on Oreos. Scientist gets murdered by corrupt cops. J’onn infiltrates police as Detective John Johns, finds out that the corruption is spearheaded by some alien menace (maybe a White Martian, like Commander Blanx, or Despero, or someone completely new even). J’onn assumes his ‘Superhero’ look, draws said menace into the open, and thoroughly trounces him.
End Credits.

Not. Hard.

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mygif

I had my own thoughts (spoilers in review) http://socialistatheistnerddude.blogspot.com/2011/06/review-of-green-lantern.html

To sum up, no, it wasn’t good. I disagree with MGK here. It deserves its low RT score.

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Jason: There was that ‘Superman’ movie, way back when. Also, ‘V for Vendetta’ was alright.

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No, it doesn’t deserve the low RT score.

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fsherman said on June 19th, 2011 at 8:37 am

Someguy, I agree. Though I was thinking of it more from the POV of Det. Jones’ partner who slowly begins to suspect there’s something odd about his buddy …

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mygif

This review nails exactly what is wrong with the movie: the script. They tried making Hal into more of a doubter than he is supposed to be, they didn’t really give more character development to the supporting cast, they raced through most of the story just to get to the finale… it felt rote, predictable, going through the motions, etc. Sad.

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That Guy said on June 19th, 2011 at 10:04 am

Reasons for GL being lackluster but ok: They. Used. Hal.

There I said it and I’m unrepentant.

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mygif

I think part of the problem is that no one can make talking about “the yellow light of FEAR” sound good.

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mygif

My personal gripe for all modern superhero movies is about how long the film takes to get past the ‘origin’ story and into the meat of things. Some movies handle origin stories well (Iron Man, Batman Begins, Kick-Ass) while others labour the point.

I thought that “Green Lantern” would fall into this trap through its attempt to completely explain the GL mythos in the movie plus somehow fit in some kind of Earth-based story. Although it’s something for the fans to see (say) Kilowog on screen, it means nothing to the general audience and takes time to fit together. That’s time (in theory, anyway) you could be using to make the audience like the main character.

I’ll go off and see it, but wasn’t expecting much to begin with.

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mygif

Why is Sinestro taking the yellow ring? Because rookie Earthman Hal Jordan did by himself what Sinestro and his team could not, working together. Sinestro suddenly has an inferiority complex, so he might was well use his fear of inferiority as his weapon.

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mygif

I agree with all of this. Went in expecting a bigger trainwreck, actually enjoyed some parts of it, but still felt it whiffed on that slow pitch. And to take nothing away from your “script” diagnosis (completely agreed), I would add that this movie had some truly awful editing decisions. I swear to god I got whiplash from at least one of them. It felt disorienting and meant that it was several seconds into the next scene before I had put together how we got there from the LAST scene.

In that regard, maybe there is a better cut of the movie that exists somewhere, once things that were filmed and intended to be in it, but taken out, are added back again.

But that still wouldn’t really help with the script. I would have given a lot for it NOT to play Hal as a reluctant or self-doubting hero, because that feels expected, and also because, as you say, it’s impossible for the audience to relate to. But if I got into everything I would have done differently, we’d be here all day. (Just one more: this movie did not need Hector Hammond. At ALL. It didn’t need two villains, and it didn’t need to waste Hammond like that, and I’m sorry, but Hammond is just silly-looking, please don’t put him in the same movie where you are expecting the audience to buy into a whole lot of weird-looking aliens to begin with.)

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mygif

Honestly, I’m surprised they bothered using Hal, if they weren’t going to use any of his emotional arc. I mean, Hal isn’t the one who conquers intense self-doubt in order to discover the hero within…he’s the one who always believed in himself even when he was about to wash out as a test pilot, and always believed in himself even when he barely scraped through Green Lantern training, and finally proves to everyone in the crisis that he’s as good as he thinks he is.

Basically, a Hal Jordan GL movie should follow the same essential dramatic structure as Kirk in Abrams’ Star Trek.

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mygif

They used Hal because Hal is the One True Green Lantern and everyone else was either a tagalong or merely keeping his seat warm, John.

I mean, duh. Don’t you know anything about comics?

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mygif

John – ya know, except for when Parallax made Hal fear and then used that fear to turn Hal into a world-destroyer.

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mygif

I liked this movie. A lot. I am of course, a Green Lantern fan, which probably had a lot to do with it. Yes, there were a few plot holes, but for a fun summer movie, I thought that it fit the bill admirably.

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Dan Coyle said on June 19th, 2011 at 5:33 pm

The draft of the script I read was forty pages of Geoff- I mean Hal- whining about his daddy issues, and then I gave up. I assume it was rewritten heavily, but really, not everyone has whatever issues Geoff Johns has, and I wish the guy would stop pretending his experiences are universal and have his characters dwell on their misery and NOTHING ELSE.

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mygif

too predictable, but enjoyable nonetheless… here’s my crazy idea for a green lantern movie! Bruce Campbell is Hal Jordan in “Emerald Trainwreck”, witness how he makes chainsaws & boomsticks constructs , slaughtering his friends while boozing it up to OA, seducing Carol Ferris or Arisia or [insert random girlfriend name ,human, female or otherwise] & laughing maniacally as he gets his Parallax costume & pets a yellow space bug that he names Hal jr, then back on earth the question that begs to be asked! will he feel remorse? NAAAH, Marz’s Parallax Jordan>Johns Stud Jordan! Why would you ask? Well he was more entertaining like that for one, & definitely more relatable (come on now, if you had the might of Parallax, wouldn’t you use it to selfish goals, especially if you were in a depressing mid-life crisis?)

If anyone has an idea to add to Emerald Trainwreck please let me know…

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mygif

“John – ya know, except for when Parallax made Hal fear and then used that fear to turn Hal into a world-destroyer.”

According to Geoff Johns. Hal losing his shit after having his hometown destroyed and being arrogant enough to believe that he could do better with the Guardians’ battery power than the Guardians themselves fits his character fine.

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mygif

Just to let ya know, SomeRandomGuy wants some feedback on the film too:
http://youtu.be/_-AHP7UnUoU

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mygif

I actually found Hector Hammond to be the most compelling character of the bunch. It was sad to see him get defeated and then killed so quickly. I thought his arc was much better than Hal’s.

Mark Strong as gold, and probably the best part of the movie even though he’s there for like 10 solid minutes.

I also appreciated how they wove Carol into the story, at least much better than other superhero movies as of late, with them taking the back seat and doing absolutely nothing (see: Thor, Iron Man II). Her acting was still off a bit, but not nearly as bad as I thought at first.

I liked GL. First Class was much better, but GL is solid for me. I’ll buy the Blu-Ray / DVD combo pack.

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Jason Barnett said on June 19th, 2011 at 11:09 pm

the reason why every story uses an origin is because every writer wants to define the story even if someone esle has already done it.

And there’s something I’ve been thinking about a lot lately. I’m not sure that failure and self-doubt and all the darker aspects of people are as successful as many writers think.

Because whenever you have that protaganist that isn’t a complete success the creators tell you about it everywhere, in interviews in the promos. Reality TV for example shows bad singers in their commericials. They show people flipping out so you know to expect it.

So you end up going into a movie or a TV show ad thinking, yeah they did a good job showing a doubting hero, or that woman on the show is as crazy as the ad. You ending up feeling like things are a success because you’ve seen the things the creators of the story told you would be there.

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Sofa King said on June 20th, 2011 at 7:58 am

A) Would not have used Ryan Reynolds. He’s good and all, but it’s still too snarky.

B) Where did he learn swordfighting?

C) Not too sympathetic to a guy who costs hundreds of people their jobs then kills three of them who understandably feel pissed at him.

4) Kilowog trains him for a day and he pusses out? And I would have had more of the Corps show up to help hm at the end, show their unity.

5) Anyone else get “Hot Shots” flashbacks as he’s crashing and thinking about Daddy?

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Kid Kyoto said on June 20th, 2011 at 9:40 am

I knew they should have used Alan Scott, now there was a great Green Lantern.

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Chris Williams said on June 20th, 2011 at 11:08 am

I think my main problem with this movie is that they smooshed a great deal of GL backstory together, and the end result doesn’t hold together as well as we’d like. They also give up some very specific characterizations that defined the characters that are featured.

Hal isn’t my favorite GL, Kyle is… for reasons I can’t possibly understand. But Hal is not the Lantern that knows self-doubt or fear. He is the brash, cocky guy who is annoying, in part, because he is EXACTLY as good as he thinks he is… eventually.

Sinestro isn’t as uncertain or fearful as they make him out to be. Sinestro always knows that he’s right and his way is the only way, he never has any doubts about it regardless of what the rules and regulations say. One of the coolest parts of Sinestro’s origin is that he’s *too* ordered for the Guardian’s standards, as he drifts into Lawful Evil vs their Lawful Good. His downfall should come from that natural progression, not the donning of the yellow ring. It just horribly belittles the character to turn his downfall into ‘Oops, put on the wrong ring’.

In terms of teachign the corps to face fear, there are parallels to the concept in Green Lantern Rebirth. Where essentially the Lanterns collectively have to face, and defy their fear to defeat Parallax, but I’m not big on them incorporating it into this movie.

Despite that, and editing that could at best be called ham-handed, there were still moments at the end that ‘got’ me. But that’s probably just because I’m a huge GL geek in general and so him reciting the oath before laying the smack-down on Parallax was kind of cool. The movie itself deserves a better RT score than it’s gotten, but it deserved a better script too.

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mygif

We can probably blame Joseph Campbell for the “hero overcomes self-doubt” cliche, but it’s become widespread and pernicious. I’m not sure why studio execs think watching supposed heroes whine their way through a movie, but it’s the thing to do now.

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mygif

@Jim McClain: If they had anything in the movie showing that was Sinestro’s reason for putting on the Yellow Ring, it would have worked better than what they did:

SINESTRO: “We need to use the Yellow energy to defeat the guy who was so corrupted by Yellow energy that he’s going to kill everything!”

GUARDIANS: “Ok.”

Later:

HAL: “You totally don’t need to do that! I’m the star of an action movie, so I’ll be able to defeat this no problemo!”

SINESTRO: “Ok.”

End of movie:

SINESTRO: “You did good, kid.”

During the credits:

SINESTRO: “Oh shit, we need to set up a sequel? What can I … wait a minute!”

It was a solid popcorn movie, but it should have been a lot more than just that.

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R.A. Bartlett said on June 20th, 2011 at 4:17 pm

I think the thing about reviews is, critics don’t WANT to be seen as snobby as they are accused, so they’ll try to be easier on things they think audiences will like.

Also, a lot of those movies that were listed, Daredevil, Ghost Rider, Spider-Man 3, were the first superhero or summer blockbuster movies in quite while. Green Lantern is smack in the middle of summer.

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mygif

“I think the thing about reviews is, critics don’t WANT to be seen as snobby as they are accused, so they’ll try to be easier on things they think audiences will like.”

I don’t know a single critic who thinks that way. And I’m a critic.

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dangermouse said on June 21st, 2011 at 6:04 am

If you have to do a character arc with Hal Jordan, you do one where he’s too sure of himself, fucks up in some way because he’s overconfident, then learns that confidence isn’t incompatible with humility, or some shit like that.

And if you don’t want to fuck around with an arc, just use the Abrams Kirk non-arc model mentioned above.

I mean I don’t even fucking like Hal, but basing a plot around him being unsure of himself is just stupid.

Oh well, that’s what happens when you let Johns out of the comics playpen.

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fsherman said on June 22nd, 2011 at 8:33 am

dangermouse, the Superboy book (eighties? late seventies?) did a retcon along those lines: Superboy has to keep bailing a teenage Hal out because he’s completely fearless and hasn’t learned to assess “Hmm, this is probably just going to get me killed” as a logical restraint.

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mygif

Yeah, reading the description just makes me mad at Geoff Johns. If Hal is all apprehensive and afraid, then the ring didn’t do its job. Get Guy in there.

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magus_69 said on June 23rd, 2011 at 4:14 am

About Movie!Hal: it’s like the writers were told to do Hal Jordan when they wanted to do Kyle Rayner, and we got the worst of both worlds (Hal’s cockiness without the confidence, Kyle’s initial manchild-stage without the sensitivity and creativity).

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Brian T. said on June 26th, 2011 at 4:17 am

Hal Jordan was based at least partly on Paul Newman. So, things about him that people react negatively to now were really just a different generation’s idea of what a cool guy would be like.

Sure, they played with things like having him be Green Arrow’s conservative foil and stuff like that, but really… he should be basically Butch Cassidy with a power ring.

Geoff Johns will have a lot to answer for some day. Trying to retcon in a bunch of psychological B.S. to explain stuff other writers did with Hal Jordan is definitely on the list.

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