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@Peztopiary

You know, I honestly liked liked what they did with Tony post-Civil War. I really did.

Tony became a supervillain, committed a ton of war crimes, got a bunch of his current and former friends fucked up, got his company destroyed, and the precedents that he (and before him, Nick Fury) set with regard to what SHIELD could get away with were directly responsible for someone EVEN WORSE getting their hands on it. How do you come back from that?

You don’t.

You DIE.

Which is what happened. Invincible Iron Man’s “World’s Most Wanted” arc is about Tony atoning for his past sins by fixing what he can, then killing himself (in a pretty awesome fight with Norman, by the way) and arranging to have himself replaced by a former version who presumably won’t be evil.

I thought it was really good.

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@Murc that is a good assesment of Fraction’s corrective to the ‘OMG Fascist Tony’ sprung on us during the Civil War tie-ins.

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Willie Everstop said on August 16th, 2010 at 8:14 pm

I thought it was funny that after the Avenger’s very first meeting Tony Stark supposedly went digging through the couch cushions for Thor hair.

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DistantFred said on August 16th, 2010 at 10:46 pm

@Murc: Hey, remember the last time they did that with Iron Man, and Tony Stark ended up a teenager?

Who’d’ve ever thought they’d revisit THAT particular character note again? I mean, the Crossing was universally reviled and almost immediately forgotten, and so was Teen Tony after Onslaught. You’d have thought that the fans would never have wanted to see him betray everyone and then kill himself heroically to make up for it again.

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@DistantFred

Actually, I don’t remember that. I didn’t start reading the Marvel Universe until ’99, and not in a SERIOUS way until 2004 or so, at which point all of that was history. I know OF it, of course, but I have no real personal memories of the story itself and have not been real inclined to go track down the issues in general, even in torrent form.

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Matthew Johnson:

So basically, you’re saying a fascist police state might be the only solution to the problem of superpowers?

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“This doesn’t mean that mutants-as-teenagers is wrong, it just means that the “well, are they actually a threat?” metric is wrong. It returns bad results consistently. Mutants are EVERY minority that’s ever been oppressed. That includes teenagers.”

Ah but teenagers ARE a threat to the exisiting society, they have new ideas, they change standards and norms and they will inevitably win.

Sure the kid down the street with his tatoos and his peircings and his weird politics is not on the same level as a kid with killer eye beams but that’s the whole point of comics, to take a subtle issue and blow it up into colorful folks punching one another.

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mygif

Did you ever read “God Loves, Man Kills”? it took that idea of Minority and persecution to the extreme, and was pretty damn enjoyable.

I agree with you, that the metaphor doesn’t work; I’m a Latino, and unfortunately, other than being Brown, I can’t shoot eye beams or fly (we should work on that)
But what I always thought they could go for, was the idea of one’s own potential, that out of the fear of Society, we were not allowed to be our full result.
I tried to do this with my comic VIGIL http://www.graphicsmash.com/comics/vigil.php which ended up being a failure and I’m rebooting to a degree, about potentials. I think Vonnegut had a short story that was being adapted into a movie that said the same, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vi6TTNKdgSk
I think that angle would matter more to me.

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mygif

Probably the oppressed minority who would actually be the best parallel to Marvel’s mutants would be people with psychiatric conditions (and I say this as someone with several psych conditions, btw). Some psychiatric conditions do make a person more likely to be dangerous (eg pedophilia, psychopathy, or the various conditions that make it hard to control your temper), and others do not (eg anxiety, depression, schizophrenia) but get lumped into the same general category of prejudice.

Plus, the relative risk varies between conditions and between individuals (eg one person with borderline personality might just have a tendency to scream and cry a lot, while another might start grabbing whatever weapons are handy to hurt whoever upset them). There are also people with psych conditions who don’t care if they hurt others, and people who care but might not be able to help it.

Sure, even the most dangerous psych conditions fall well short of the danger that some mutants pose, but it’s a lot better analogy than any other oppressed minority I can think of.

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